The Tam & Noll (T&N) architects and City Staff took the lead Aug. 26, “dancing” the Hillview Task Force through the pros & cons of two nearly identical versions of interior space allocation.
The two “examples’ were developed by incorporating the preferences the Task Force expressed at the prior Aug. 8 meeting. But the scenarios also reflected the “programming” expertise of our Director of Recreation, Manny Hernandez. He affirmed that the two interior space allocations would meet the space needs of the current City program and also the aspirational programming needs of the future.
…a breakout group of Hillview Task Force looking at the Max Flex vs. Big Living Room…space allocation “examples.” Director Of Recreation Manny Hernandez on left rear in light blue shirt.
To be clear, the Hillview Task Force space planning going on right now is for accommodating only the City programming. “Tenants” like MVLA Adult Education, Friends of the Library, and Children’s Corner are not part of the construction plan or budget.
Lalahpolitico: MVLA Adult Ed will still be offering nearly identical senior courses at the MV Senior Center just as it does now. Friends of the Library expects to be accommodated – perhaps in a portable – for several years, until a new library building can be financed. Children’s Corner has made an offer to “pay for” adding another 3000 of interior space [ 4000 gross building space.]
…another breakout group of Hillview Task Force examines Max Flex vs. Big Living Room
The Hillview Task Force is not the “decider” about the Children’s Corner offer. That decision will be made by council. On Aug. 26, the Task Force agreed it’s role did not include having an opinion on that. Therefore, it seems staff will present the proposal to City Council at an upcoming publicly noticed meeting soon. It conceivably could be decided before the Sept. 26 City Council Study Session, where Council will review the Hillview Task Force Recommendations for space allocation and for a preferred site locations. Lalahpolitico: The T&N architects will need to know sooner rather than later if the 20,000 gross sq. foot building is actually going to be a 24,000 gross sq. foot building with Children’s Corner in it.
Potential New Hillview Sites
from lowest cost to highest-
choose 3 of the 5
This is existing parking on the Civic Center now. Not changing the parking lots, lowers the cost of construction of the New Hillview.
On Aug. 26 T&N presented 5 site options to the Hillview Task Force. They were presented in order of increasing cost…1, 2, 3 were within budget…4, 5 would go over budget and will require asking Council for extra budget. All were one-story plans. Lalahpolitico: presumably T&N are not adding architectural articulation and all that fine stuff to these diagrams at this time..in the future the building shapes could be more complex/articulated.
The job of the Hillview Task Force was to choose at most 3 of the 5.
Site 1 – Maximize old trees- meh!
Site one maximizes preserving the largest number of exisiting healthy trees. It requires the lowest landscaping budget. No change to the parking
Rejected by the Hillview Task Force. Site 1 preserves trees, reducing landscaping costs. An old HV wing could remain in the rear or be torn town for more open space. No change to the parking stalls
Site 2 – A bit closer to theatre- meh!
The building is described by T&N as a bit more connected to the theatre. At the Aug, 26 meeting, task force members just didn’t see much difference between 1 and 2.
Rejected by the Hillview Task Force. The building is bit more connected to the theatre. At least it is more visible at the theatre.
Site 3 – Line of Sight from Downtown- ok
The building can be glimpsed from downtown, but is pushed into the NE corner of the land. The plan could meet budget, largely because it does not disturb the existing parking lot.
Acceptable to the Task Force. The building would be viewable from San Antonio. It preserves the existing parking lot.
Site 4 – Closer to Theater, Museum, Library – yeah
This plan was described as somewhat over budget because some of the existing parking lot is removed and may need to be replaced. [It is possible Council could lower parking ratios…etc. TBD]. About half the Hillview Task Force liked it best because it connected to downtown strongly, without going much over budget. Just a few parking stalls worth?
Most preferred by about half of the Task Force…mainly because it establishes a connection to downtown, but is only slightly over budget. Now the building has been pulled closer to the theatre, the History Museum and the library…where the action is.
Site 5 – Strongest connection to theatre, library- yeah
About half the Hillview Task Force said this was their most preferred location. It goes a significant amount over budget because of the need to rebuild the Soccer Field in a new location. It does have the virtue that during construction, the old Hillview can remain standing. Staff and programs can continue without the need to set up portables [which are not cheap….utilitiy hook up around 100K? plus rent].
Soccer games will need to be moved elsewhere during construction. It was not clear if the new location on the site of the old Hillview provides for a regulation size field size. The cost was unknown, but believed to start at $1M. {Lalah: in the 2014 planning this was a discussed option, so I recall that a field does fit, but $2-3M was the figure bandied about?}
This option was the most preferred by about half the Hillview Task Force. It may cost $1-3 million to relocated the Soccer field, but the old parking lot is intact. Old HV can be left in operation during construction of the new HV.
Soil Remediation for automotive oil and gasoline may be necessary. From 1929 to at least 1946, school buses parked behind the old San Antonio School which was exactly where Alan Pinel office building is now. And the theatre there by the library is called Bus Barn, because it was a bus barn for maintenance etc. An EIR will need to be done for the soccer field.
Lalahpolitico: Well, this part of the site was off-the-table in the Task Force’s original job assignment from Council — in order to avoid the cost of moving the soccer field. Let’s see if the City Council can be convinced by Hillview Task Force to change its mind about paying to move the soccer field.
Hillview Task Force member Cathy Lazarus with the mic Aug. 26
TRAFFIC and Circulation- Hmmmmm?
As you can see, all the site plans are emphasizing automobile ingress and egress from San Antonio down the rather narrow library driveway that skirts the library building. Furthermore, the parking lot reduces Hillview Ave ingress/ egress from two driveways to one.
Hillview Task Force member Cathy Lazarus asked, ” Can that library San Antonio driveway handle the additional auto capacity? What about the impact on the 5-way intersection at Main and San Antonio 100 feet further on?”
Lalahpolitico: Better call in the City traffic engineer? Do we still have one, or do we need a consultant asap?
Interior Space Allocation
Director of Recreation Manny Hernandez and T&N staff presented the Hillview Task Force with 2 nearly identical options for space allocation. One was called ” Maximize Flexible Space.” The other was called ” Big Living Room.”
Image: Max Flex Space – one more classroom
Both Allocations have the same Community Room and the Same Senior Room. Kinderprep is a given at 1000 in both programs. In Max Flex, instead of a teen room there is a Multi-generaltional games room, which would attract teens after 3: 30.
Janet Tam listened intently to to 3 breakout groups describe likes /dislikes about the options… and quite a bit of indecision about 1) what to do with teen?s 2) and with a large lobby vs. a little office and extra flexible classroom vs. a cafe or just a food cart?
Image: Big Living Room – 2x size lobby
This option has a teen room, instead of a multi-generational game room, but is “shared”…so is not so different from the Max Flex game room. This option has one less multipurpose classroom because there is a very large lobby 2000 vs. 1000 sq feet in the Max Flex plan.
So let’s just look at Janet Tam’s wrap up of the Hillview Task Force’s feelings. “Here’s what I think I heard you say.” She paused frequently to see if anyone wanted to speak up up and change her synopsis.
In a nutshell, Janet Tam got the permission of the Taskforce to design for this…
Community Room- 2500 sq feet. Dine, dance, lecture…
All Hillview Task Force members agreed that 2500 was the right size for a community room. This is very similar in size to the existing MPR at Hillview where used book sales and other events are held. Accompanying the new 2500 Hillview dining room/ lecture room…depending on how the room is set up.. is a big kitchen (700) and storage(450). .
This room can be programmed for the existing Senior weekly Hillview Lunch. Like our existing facilities this space will be available to rent for corporate or wedding events . Rates may go up for such rentals to match market prices for similar quality. Keep in mind that these rents subsidize city provided programming.
Interior furnishing and design is very important in a recreation center.
The community rooms will have adequate storage for the the two pictured event set ups.
Senior Center – 2000 sq ft.
All Hillview Task Force members concurred that 2000 was the right size for a dedicated senior space. At the existing Hillview, the Senior Lounge is Rm 10 plus Rm 11 has an interior door connection — that totals to just under 2000 feet now. [Room 12 – 1000 – is used for very occasional senior classes…but very lightly used by anyone apparently].
Here is a sketch of how a 2000 square foot senior center might be arranged. There might be a flex wall separator or a real wall between two main areas. Acoustics matter a lot to seniors.
There was some surprise among the Hillview Task Force that the current senior center runs so breifly from about 8:30 to 3:30…because “that’s when seniors want to leave“. Mr. Hernandez thought that in a new building the time of day pattern could change perhaps. There was group discussion about whether any of the senior space could be useful to other age groups outside of 8:30-3:30.
Architect Janet Tam pointed out that the small conference table [green circle] could be used as a small conference room for a social worker visit, or anyone needing to hold a small short meeting…outside of senior hours. She spoke about a “concierge/club model”. Lalahpolitico: this was unexplained. Tam also said it was possible that a small office could be carved into the 2000 space for a visiting nurse or social worker private conversation place.
Lalahpolitico: We expect this area will be designed with the hard-of-hearing in mind. Plenty of noise-dampening please. Carpets, fabric wall covering. Windows yes, but maybe not so many that noise bounces and amplifies. Shared places like the lobby, where it is hoped that seniors might hang out too, cannot be noisy either. Does that rule out those ceilings that expose the industrial conduit and all that stuff? Just asking?
The Lobby — somewhere in 1000 to 2000 range?
Yes, food there could attract teens
At 1000 feet we’ll get a pretty nice lobby. We could go all the way to 2000. Shown in the pic here looks like 1500 to me. Let’s be sure there is enough carpet on the floors…for the hard of hearing. Tile only on the traffic paths? Acoustics, acoustics!
Here – deciding on the lobby – is where the the Hillview Task Force seemed split in half or at least very indecisive. At 2000 feet it would be the size of the existing Hillview social hall. Janet Tam said if is were “zoned properly” with glass walls and such, or alcoves and the right furniture, it would be inviting. Still people on the Hillview Task Force worried it might be too big, cavernous and noisy. In that case, it would become unused space. Others said that “social gathering” is important, but so is the provision of classes: a large lobby means at least one less classroom
There was discussion among the Hillview Task Force that perhaps teens didn’t need any dedicated space, but could be attracted to part of a lobby, especially if there were a cafe or food cart, and if there were a bit of separate feeling outdoor patio area. [Or a shared game room could be attractive. Kids today want to get together for real board games, socially face-to-face; they get plenty of time alone with screens at home].
Where adults work now..Can our new Hillview appeal to them? . Shown here is Air bnb. Notice how you can pick your decor from a menu – from left : mid-centruy modern, center log-cabin, vaguely oriental. Fun. Do you like thinks and yourself on display? There are security camera everywhere anyway, we might as well enjoy the exhibitionism!
Earlier Janet Tam showed interiors of workplaces located around here. What was her point? That in order to attract non-senior adults to the new community center, we will need to create a space ” as nice as the places where they work.”
Another example of a workplace lobby. Definitely looks like a contemporary up-scale living room. Will our seniors of today be comfortable with modern furnishings and materials like this? Or are we designing for the seniors of 10 years from now? I notice that Kaiser and other “hospital” providers have gone “modern.” It doesn’t seem to bother the seniors there does it?
Janet Tam wrapped up all the loose ends, by saying,”…the lobby should not be a vestibule…but generous… perhaps with moveable walls… a fine line to be drawn between too big and just right.”
Lalahpolitico: I observe that the building-room space is one thing, but the interior surfaces, lighting fixtures, and furnishings are another. The pace of change in our electronic devices is rapid, but the pace of change in interior design is also rapid. Anecdote: From experience.. around here and up and down California…all the hotel chains are ripping out their furnishings and bathrooms and going modern, and for neutral colors. In the hotel business, they start saving up for the next redo of the interior 10 years down the road, as soon as the paint dries. I think the same thing may be necessary for community centers to remain “fresh.”
Admin space looked like 4500 on Aug 8, but now has been reduced to 1200. Alot of it was actually lobby, which is proper to call a programming space, not just overhead.
Admin Space: A political mis-step of Aug 8 fixed
In the prior meeting of the Hillview Task Force on Aug. 8 , staff and the architect included the lobby in a 4,500 “non-negotiable space allocation for admin and lobby.” Since then they’ve realized this was politically incorrect, because a lobby is actually “community space.”
For the Aug. 26 meeting of the Hillview Task Force, City staff showed that staff are parsimonious, not greedy space consumers. What they actually need for back office is now a mere 1200. There is plenty of space next to the admin area for a “generous, but not cavernous” lobby for the enjoyment of the community.
Teen Space – maybe none dedicated
The Hillview Task Force was not sure a dedicated teen space was necessary at hillview. They are leaving it up to the architect to find a alcove or corner is a lobby where the kids might congregate. It is hard to attact preteens and almost impossbile to attract high schoolers.
Teens: The possible solutions ranged from no space, to an alcove in the lobby space… to dedicated space (600). This may be the most fungible of space allocation issues. The Hillview Task Force could give no concrete consensus direction…so we’ll have to see what T&N come up with.
There was a good amount of discussion of the sociology of teens. Parents on the Hillview Task Force and from the public audience who currently have teen age kids shared some relevant observations.
Teens over 12 do not want to feel watched.
The existing jr. high school center at Garden House basement at Shoup Park is not successful. Kids complain they feel they are watched. Instead they go to the LA library and to the Safeway 2nd story patio! Jr. high attendance at LAYC dances is down from 400 a couple of decades ago to under 100. Things are changing.
T&N architects and our Recreation Director agree — it is hard to attract teens to a community center space. Food helps. A feeling of not being supervised helps. Young staff at the center helps. Lalahpolitico: I think T&N will be able to create a space that might attract teens.
As Hillview Task Force member Cathy Lazarus suggested…if there is a “dedicated 600 sq ft. or so space ” initially, if it doesn’t work, just turn it into a multi-gen game room later. Lalahpoitico: makes sense to me.
In any case, the Hillview Task Force agreed to defer to the architect’s expertise in trying to create a “teen magnet” area.
Both Max Flex and Big Living Room included these
Specialized Classrooms …
One City-staffed “Kinderprep” – 1000
Right now there is City staff only for a half-day, morning session for these 20 – 24, three to five year-olds. Some Hillview Task Force members lamented this 1000 feet might not get enough use in the afternoon. Mr. Hernandez said that in the future he hoped to find contractors for afternoon kiddie classes in the room. If not that, there is always an option for a drop-in daycare operation.
The City-run Kinderprep program for 24 kids will get a new specialized room in the new Hillview. Contractors who can offer afternoon kiddie courses will be sought.
One Art Room
There will be one specialized room for the arts. It is specialized because it has sinks and extra cabinets.
One Movement Room
A movement room is a specialized space because of its special floor, mirror and sound system. You would not make art in here.
MPR – might be only one with moveable wall
Some Hillview Task Force members asked about the sound proof qualities of today’s moveable room partitions. Answer: better, but not perfect. Lalahpolitico: If this is going to work for hard-of-hearing seniors as well as for he young, it might need carpet rather than linoleum.
A large one of 1200 could be split in half with a moveable wall.
Conclusion: T& N are doing good work
We will have a new community center we can enjoy. Stay tuned. The Hillview Task Force gave space allocation guidance, but also permission to the architect to fill in the parts where they were indecisive. T&N and the Rec. Dept. are the experts, and we are not.
Next Steps: Sept. 11 will probably be a dull meeting for the Hillview Task Force. They will review a draft staff report –words only — that will be presented to City Council on Sept. 26. It will include a report on all the decisions — described in this post — made by the Hillview Task Force. It is not clear when T&N may have finished any revised graphics for the Sept. 26 Council meeting. It is possible new T&N graphics will first be seen only on Sept. 26. However, the verbal staff report will be posted with the City Council agenda on Sept. 18, which is a week before the Sept. 26 City Council Study Session.
The Hillview Task Force set future meeting dates of Oct. 3, Oct. 18, Nov. 7 and Nov. 30. T&N expects to have worked up Advanced Drawings by Oct. 18. Then the Hillview Task Force members will have something visual to take to the public and their personal social networks for the public’s reaction.
At the Aug. 26 meeting, City Manager Chris Jordan, suggested the City web site could host a online survey to collect reactions to the drawings/concepts/plan. Lalahpolitico: That’s a very good idea.
Janet Tam with mic, talking through the slides at the Aug. 26 meeting of the Hillview Task Force
Resources
T&N presentation Aug. 26 5MB file to open or download
City Web Site Hillview Task Force page…Perhaps the most useful button on that page is one for meetings…it leads to all the meeting date links…which lead to links for all the meeting reportss and slides. The slide decks don’t have informative files names, but they are ususally the last file on the meeting agenda.
More about Children’s Corner…
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Excerpt from City Manager Update email letter, August 25, 2017
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Community Center
The City of Los Altos currently leases many of its facilities to outside organizations, such as both library buildings, both Fire Stations, the Nuetra House, the History Museum, and many other indoor and outdoor facilities that are available for short term rental. One of the longer lessees (almost 40 years) is the non-profit Children’s Corner, a pre-kindergarten program at the Hillview Community Center.
At the first few meetings of the Community Center Project Task Force, the Task Force heard from several community members about the need to dedicate space in the new community center for the Children’s Corner. Because the Task Force’s assignment includes space allocation, but does not include determining how, or by who, services will be provided, staff offered to discuss the situation with representatives from Children’s Corner and report back to the Task Force regarding any space issues.
Since that time, staff has met with Children’s Corner representatives 3 times in an effort to determine if there is an opportunity for a public/private partnership. Also, it has become clear that there will not be adequate space in the new community space to commit as much as 3,000 square feet for leasing to the Children’s Corner. Therefore, the Children’s Corner has proposed to the City an arrangement that includes:
Any additional revenues received by the City as part of this potential arrangement would be used to offset the cost of the City providing other community programs that do not meet the City policy of full cost recovery. None of the City allocated $25 million will be used for any space for Children’s Corner.
If these discussions appear to provide a reasonable return on the City’s investment, while providing the community with the opportunity to have the services of the Children’s Corner continue at the new community center, staff will discuss the proposal with the Task Force. If the Task Force believes there is merit to the proposal and it could be accommodated as part of the new community center, the proposal will be provided to the City Council for its consideration. Any and all decisions will be made by the City Council.
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Lalahpolitico: The Task Force agreed on Aug. 26 that is could not approve or disapprove of the proposal. It was to be the decision of City Council. In other words, Staff can take the proposal to Council
